Thread Pops out of Thread Feeder Roller Cover Groove

[edr]

Hi All,

This last weekend, my rayon thread pops out of the groove of the Thread Feeder Roller covers while it is embroidering making the thread lose tension, create bird's nests and stop the machine for a thread breakage error. This is happening on Needles 1, 2 and 4 right now. The Madeira rayon thread on 1 and 2 I just got new last week. The thread on Needle 4 is a few years old. I could be running anywhere between 650 or 1,000 spm and the thread still will pop out and slide to the left under the red pinch rollers.

I cleaned the both the red pinch rollers and thread feeder rollers with alcohol. That seemed to help a bit, but not totally eliminate the problem. Consequently, I had to watch the thread feeders like a hawk and try to stop the machine when threads pop out (about every 500 stitches or so). The red pinch rollers are showing a light beige stripe down the center where it comes in contact with the thread. I didn't have the problem when I started using the thread the first 1-2 days.

The Amaya XT is relatively new (got it last May and it currently has a Z Run Time of 40:32:28). I even did the 4,000,000 Stitches/Revolutions maintenance on it the first day I had it because Amaya OS told me to. That removes, cleans and lubricates the thread rollers. I thought that was odd for a new machine, but the Melco Tech said it wouldn't hurt and I would learn anyway.

Can anyone please let me know if there is anything else I can do to fix this problem?

Thanks!
Ed

[edr]

More information on this. It only happens when I am doing column satin stitches (1/8" wide). I did try increasing the column feed adjustment from 40 to 55 to decrease the thread feed in Tools/Settings/Thread Feed. That did not help. It appears that the thread is too slippery for the thread feeder rollers to keep it aligned in the groove.

Thanks,
Ed

[elaine]

have you tried replacing the pinch roller? I have only come across this problem when the rollers need to be replaced or if you have gotten grease on the rollers.

[edr]

No I haven't replaced the pinch rollers. What's the useful life of them? I've had this new Amaya XT for less than three months. Sometimes the thread will wrap around the pinch rollers after a thread cut is done. Maybe the loop that is created in front and under the pinch roller in this process is too big??

Also, I noticed that there are a few tiny red flakes from the pinch rollers in a few places, especially noticeable on the thread bar with all the holes under the takeup levers where you feed the thread before you pass it down to the needle. Is this common or do I have defective pinch rollers?

Should I call Melco Support?

Thanks--Ed

[Rod or Sharon]

Hi Ed,
As techs in the field, we have only seen one yellow pinch roller that has had to be replaced---they last and last.

The red "flakes" or powder you are referring to is from lack of lubrication. Did you go completely through your machine when you got it and oil and lube everything? This should always be done because you don't know how long, or where, or the temperature that machine has been sitting in.

Sharon

[Rod or Sharon]

Ed, I also forgot to mention, DO NOT use alcohol to clean your rollers. Use only hot water and soap. (And your rollers may be a whitish color--still same as yellow for durability---they will last a long, long time).
Sharon

[Rod or Sharon]

And, the beigh color you referred to seeing on the roller from the thread is only dye or the waxy finish on the thread---not a problem.
Sharon

[edr]

Hi Elaine,

Thanks for giving me an idea of what to do. I just hit the 2,000,000 Maintenance Interval yesterday. That should give some idea how much I have used the Amaya so far.

I decided to look at the lubrication of the pinch roller by pulling the roller off as instructed in the 4,000,000 maintenance. It was dry as a bone and had some polymer crud around the lever post it spins around. After cleaning and relubricating the post with EMB polymer grease, I am able to stitch at 1,000 spm (and probably faster) with no problem at all on that needle and thread. It is humming along.

So the hard lesson learned....don't wait for the recommended scheduled interval. If you have this problem, and especially if you see specks of red flakes under the pinch roller, it may be time to regrease your rollers again. I think I heard you folks say not to wait for the scheduled maintenance intervals over and over again. So true in this case!

Thanks!
Ed

[signman]

We got our new XT last month-after 4 years with 'big red' we still arranged for our local tech to be here and run over it before we even turned it on the first time. That way any problems would be documented by a tech on-the-spot, and any adjustments would be made correctly. It's off warranty service-we had no problem paying his bill because of the 'comfort' factor knowing that we started with a perfectly fine-tuned machine!
He did do the complete 'lube oil and filter' check... (lol) so that everything was gone over with a fine tooth comb and gentle hand.
Anything that has gone wrong since we've traced back to 'operator'(my wife) error...
I only do the digitizing now and let her run it!

[Juli in Kona]

Buy an extra set of red rollers. They are not very expensive and it can save you a bunch of time when doing maintenance on the roolers. Cleaning the rollers and lubing them takes al the time. You can lub the red rollers ahead of time. Then just snap of the reds, clean the old grease off the black parts and snap the new prepared rollers back on. I take off all the red rollers at one time and clean them later at my convienence.

Juli in Kona

[elaine]

im glad you found the help you needed
[img]smile.gif[/img]

[edr]

Hi Sharon, Juli and Elaine,

Thanks for information! Guess I was on the right track to check the lubrication of the pinch rollers before I saw your response. Hope I didn't compromise any of the 4 rollers by lightly cleaning them with rubbing alcohol. I won't do that again!

In an order I placed with Eli this morning at Melco Parts before I saw Juli's response, I ordered half a dozen red pinch rollers, thinking that I would just replace the pinch rollers for the "more used" needles as they wore out. But I like Juli's idea of having an extra set of 16 to do as she recommended. Eli recommended I buy the whole kit of rollers, pinch rollers and covers for around $120.00. I thought....geez I hope I don't need to replace all those very soon for this new machine. So I just bought the pinch rollers--I'll buy 10 more in my next order.

Since lubricating my rollers, coupled with the large table top for the 20.7 x 16.8 hoop, I was just amazed yesterday to watch my XT set at 1,500 spm stitch a 2-1/2 hour/14.5" x 14.5"/180,000 stitch design flawlessly with large cones of Madeira rayon thread with Actifeed set at auto. Of course AOS would slow the spm depending on what it was stitching, but it never went lower than 1,000 spm. Stitching was interrupted just with an occasional bobbin thread ran out message. I think I had maybe 4 thread breaks at those fast speeds in 2 1/2 hours embroidering on silk with just one layer of Madeira E-Zee Specialty Poly Mesh 1.5 oz....Simply Amazing! Something I could never achieve on my home Bernina, Viking and Pfaff machines.

Fortunately, I don't have the problems now with Madeira thread that some on this forum are experiencing. Some of my Madeira threads are 10+ years old. I don't have problems with the cones vibrating or moving around with just the white spool things on the thread posts. I don't pull the plastic tubing out of the thread posts as Madeira recommended in the document John posted on this site (I think that is hokey!).

I bought this Amaya XT for a hobby as I have many, many personal projects I want to complete for myself. Too bad I don't have time to make any money off of it. All these hoops, Slimline 1 and 2, etc., etc. that I bought are expensive. Fortunately I already had all the Isacord and Madeira threads and backings. I'm going to enjoy bliss while I have it!

Thanks all!
Ed

[Rod or Sharon]

Ed,

The testing at Melco is done at 1200spm for the most part....just because folks have a Lamborginni(sp) sports car capable of 250 mph doesn't mean that they can/need to run it at that speed .

Just remember, the faster you run, the more friction, the more friction, the more heat is generated on moving parts and this means more lubrication at shorter intervals.

I am happy you have had a pleasurable experience with this particular combination using rayon thread....it certainly has not been my exerience for the last several years.

I remember, several years ago, in my beginning training, the first design I stitched out on a cap in the classroom, It went without a hitch, ran without stopping and no thread breaks. The instructor told me ..."beginners luck Rod, beginners luck.." it took a while for that to sink in... and she was sooooo right...

I have learned to hate rayon thread for the most part, but the tools in OS, if used properly, can make things a bit less frustrating, some of the time...

Ed, I have to say it....Beginners luck my friend....beginners luck... ;-}

Rod Springer
Amaya Tech & Trainer

[Rod or Sharon]

Ed, as an additional note for the Rayon thread, I think it has beautiful sheen but do remember that it is not colorfast. If you stitched on a white baby bib and then it needed washed with bleach in the water, your embroidery work would come out "white". I have several bibs I made for our grandchildren and used Polyester thread. They look today as nice as they did the day I made them and have been bleached many times. Just something to remember about Rayon vs Polyester thread.
Sharon

[edr]

Hi Rod and Sharon,

Thanks for the words of wisdom. I learn so much from you seasoned professionals that make my learning curve as small as possible. Thank you!

I am aware about the pros and cons about rayon and polyester.....that's why I have both and many other thread types.

This project is a silk quilt that won't be washed or subject to wear and tear. In addition to that....using man made polyester thread on natural silk charmeuse, dupioni and brocade would be considered not appropriate by some.....mais non, jamais! The XT passed the test of using fine thread and fabric with just one layer of thin non-adhesive drapeable backing.

I am not new to embroidery....just new to a commercial machine like the XT. I have over 10 years of digitizing and embroidery experience with my home machines. I want to see what experience I can transfer to the use of the XT.

I'm very pleased that I am able to use the XT with these fabrics and thread. I've got more projects planned with other types of threads, fabrics and backings that will test the ability of this fine machine.

Thanks!
Ed